It’s like the second you notice parallels in our two party system, they misrepresent you as saying they are EXACTLY the same in EVERY REGARD.

Meanwhile, we no longer question why we only have two parties to vote for in the first place. Hint: the two parties keep it that way.

As you say, it depends on how we interpret the words. It’s only a logical contradiction if “the left” is taken as a singular term rather than as a general description. The former is less charitable but it does happen.

In any case, I’m willing to admit that I chose the title based on an alliterative flourish.

Agreed, but I can’t be too critical of the American people. Most of us are kept in a perpetual state of “getting by”.

Why do those establishment Dems exist? Because people vote for them… More importantly you have to convince the rest of America of your ideals with feet on the ground and conversations with real people.

This much is true, but leftist ideas have been intentionally made taboo since the Cold War/Red Scare. Average Americans recognize their quality of life decreasing but would rather vote in a strong-man than address capitalism itself. Unfortunately, this country is closer to authoritarianism than it is to prioritizing the well-being of its citizens.

Instead you bitch about them,

During the election, it was the wrong time to criticize democrats. Now the election has passed and it is still the wrong time to criticize democrats. When are we supposed to remark on our lack of a voice in the two-party system?

…complain about “liberals” and further the divide with them.

I also criticize Republicans on here but that is preaching to the choir. The more that I read about the history of this country and the present-day agenda of furthering the privileges of the wealthy, the harder it is to care about your party’s unity.

on the ground and conversations with real people. I’m not seeing any of this.

…And so it isn’t happening?

Get off Lemmy. It’s not the real world

Posting a meme is not activism. But you would be mistaken to assume my political engagement ends there.

I’ve endorsed voting five times already in this thread and yet I still get the same response. It’s like Americans think civil engagement begins and ends at voting. Ironically, the point of this post is to call that very line of thinking into question.

The enduring ideology of the political establishment is the promotion and protection of the ruling class’ interests–invariably at the expense of the working class. Both parties serve the same master, and because there are only two, the voters don’t have much say in the matter. Progressives, like Bernie, who call out the billionaire donors are the exception to the rule. (More on him later.)

Seen from the leftist perspective, the overlap in the Venn Diagram is a consistent commitment from our politicians to put profits over people. It is why both George Bush and Barack Obama bailed out Wall Street (to give just one example of corporate welfare). It is why SCOTUS declared corporations “people” and campaign donations “free speech”. It’s why the U.S. has engaged in neo-imperialism over the land, labour, natural resources, and markets of developing nations. It’s why the CIA assassinated democratically elected leaders in South America and Asia. It’s why we’ve had decades of stock market growth while wages continue to stagnate. This is not accidental: the system is working as intended.

If Bernie had been elected in 2016 the outcome for the DNC would likely have been just as dramatic. If you want the Democratic party to be a leftist party, go make it one. We’ve literally seen a major party pushed to fascism. You know know change is possible.

I wrote this in another comment but I’ll reiterate here. Bernie did not get a fair chance at the presidency. The DNC limited the number of debates (not allowing their favourite to be taken to task), they gave Hillary debate questions ahead of time, gave Trump/Clinton all the media coverage, etc. It is damn near impossible to succeed as a third-party candidate (sorry, Jill Stein) so a self-proclaimed socialist has to run as a Democrat and play by their rule book. And they don’t even have to play by their own rules! (Court Concedes DNC Had the Right to Rig Primaries Against Sanders.) When AOC runs, they’ll do the same thing and then she will spend her time in Congress backing establishment democrats. Please realize that the political elite would much rather shift to the right than to the left. The far left-wing actually threatens the profits of the wealthy.

You could make the same argument about any third party candidate, which would ignore their tremendous disadvantage in our current system. The DNC tilted support in Clinton’s favour from the beginning:

• Court Concedes DNC Had the Right to Rig Primaries Against Sanders
• WikiLeaks emails showing Clinton received debate questions ahead of time

Also, consider Obama. Obama did get more votes than Hillary. Obama had a majority in Congress. Obama literally ran on hope and change. And yet he continued in the same problematic behaviours. Government bailouts for the rich, drone strikes, holding prisoners in Guantanamo Bay for years without due process, persecuting whistleblowers, the list goes on.

Even when we find “better candidates” they either work for the system or fail to change it.

I’ve already agreed that we should vote. But it’s not enough.

Progressive ideas have effectively been taken off the table since the Cold War. Even if we can get more progressives in Congress, the establishment dems sideline them. It’s easier for both parties to move to the right because this does not threaten the wealth and privileges of the oligarchy.

Any progressive running for president is, for that reason, fighting against the odds. And when they lose, they take the energy behind their campaign and redirect it to support “centrist” democrats. That’s it, two political parties and we call ourselves a democracy.

Let me guess: Democrats are completely innocent in our present state of this affairs, right? If we just elect the right Democrats to all three branches of government, they will fix all our problems. Is that it?

I don’t blame you: I used to think the same. But what does it take to see this is a bipartisan problem? We have President Biden and Bernie Sanders both warning about the oligarchy, and you people think they’re just talking about Republicans. For fucks sake…

At least you have more than two options. We literally cannot vote against anything that two political parties agree on. What’s more, anti-establishment forces like Bernie Sanders and AOC are either sidelined or used to redirect voter dissatisfaction into votes for establishment candidates. So while I agree with the need to effect change locally, its doubtful that we can enact meaningful change at the federal level.

Like what happened with Bernie Sanders? Like how things would be different with Obama?

Again, there is too much overlap on the Venn Diagram. The source of these problem is the two-party system itself, which means it will never change through voting. We effectively have a democratic voice for things that the parties disagree on, but do not have a voice for anything that both parties agree on.

To clarify: I endorse voting because it takes, maybe, an hour of your time every year. (We should have a national voting day, but that’s another discussion.) Great, that disclaimer is now out of the way.

The two parties are playing good-cop/bad-cop for the oligarchy. Republicans push the ruling class’ agenda and the Democrats pretend to stop them.

Meanwhile, income inequality has been exploding for almost 50 years. The cost of housing, groceries, healthcare, college, child care, insurance, debt are increasing as money is systematically SIPHONED from the lower classes. Productivity increases, the rich get richer, and the bottom of the pyramid (i.e., those who have wages instead of assets) are forced to live on the edge of financial ruin. One missed paycheck or one medical emergency away from homelessness.

The implication of this post is the need for civic engagement in addition to voting. We’re going to need grassroots organization. Mass protests, boycotts, strikes, and civil disobedience are all required to take the country back from the oligarchy.

Voting is necessary civil engagement: but it is insufficient. Both parties agree on the two-party system. Both parties agree on first past the post voting. Both parties agree on taking money from “good” billionaires (i.e., legal bribery). Both parties agree on insider trading. Both parties agree on government bailouts. Both parties agree on proxy wars. And so on. In a two-party system, who do we vote for to address these issues?

Of course there are meaningful difference between the parties. But they use social issues (e.g., immigration) to divide the American people so they do not notice just how much both parties agree on. We need deeper systemic changes to this system that literally will never happen through voting.

This also applies to Biden. So many leftists held their nose for Biden due to his progressive promises and in order to “usher in” a new generation of progressives afterwards.