• JayDee@lemmy.sdf.org
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      The first experience for many is crushing despair. It can take time to get out of that slump and learn to find meaning in a meaningless world.

  • HelixDab2@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    1 month ago

    Honestly, this is why I don’t discuss Mormon history and the massive, gaping chasms in their claims of Truth with my parents. My parents are old–old enough that the family is talking about who is going to call the coroner, who’s going to deal with tying up finances, etc.–and knowing that they’ve wasted an entire lifetime and hundreds of thousands of dollars in tithing on a con isn’t going to do anything useful at this point. Fifty years ago? Sure, they would have had plenty of time to come to terms with it. Now? Meh.

    • Whats_your_reasoning@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      When I worked in a nursing home, I was Christian.

      I mean, I wasn’t. At all. But the dying little old ladies who sundowned so bad that they sometimes thought I was their grandchild? When they asked if I believed in Jesus, I’d bite my tongue and tell them yes. I hated having to lie to their faces, I hate even thinking about it all these years later, but some of them had nothing to look forward to except “going to heaven” by that point. Lying seemed the most ethical choice.

      • jdf038@mander.xyz
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 month ago

        I mean to make it easier I guess I would just tell myself I am convinced that Jesus existed. So I believe in him. But not “in Him” capital H.

        Or you could imagine yourself cheering Jesus on and hoping he will do well in sports ball for the Jerusalem league. I could see him as a solid basketball player with the magical powers and all.

        Nothing wrong with lying there obviously.

      • RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 month ago

        I would think you’d need to tell lots of lies to someone in that state to not make things difficult over and over for them. Jesus would just be another one on that pile.

        • Whats_your_reasoning@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          edit-2
          1 month ago

          You got it. Sometimes the safest thing to do when somebody’s having hallucinations is to play along, and that means telling lots of lies. Sometimes people think their kids (who are well into their 60s) are still newborns, and they will have a panic attack because they don’t know where their “baby” is. I’ve reassured people that I “just set the baby down to nap” numerous times.

          I’ve seen people treat dolls like real babies, too, and one time a lady rolled up to me in her wheelchair, asking to see a doctor because her baby (a doll with food smeared over its mouth) wasn’t eating. I even went so far as to get those “magic” doll bottle things that appear to “empty” when you tip them.

          Point is, you’re right. But I don’t feel as conflicted about all the other lies I told, I guess the religion thing is just too … I dunno, “icky” for me? I’m an out atheist with pretty much everyone else. I don’t like having to go back into a closet.

          • RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            1 month ago

            One set of lies is about their past or present. The Jesus one is about their future. It’s a lot easier to lie to someone about the former two than to tell them there’s no future, they’ll never be whole or happy again. We all need a reason to look forward, a reason to keep the chin up and carry on. Most anyone can empathetically understand how crushing it would be if they were told that they were going to die soon, so telling an Alzheimer’s victim that there’s nothing to look forward to rings a similar bell in our heads.

    • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      edit-2
      1 month ago

      knowing that they’ve wasted an entire lifetime and hundreds of thousands of dollars in tithing on a con isn’t going to do anything useful at this point.

      It always gets me how people can be so comfortable with tithing while so prickly about paying taxes. I’ve straight up heard “every dollar I give to the government is one I can’t give to the church” as an argument, when the town and state I’m living in is joined at the hip with the church they love.

      Fifty years ago? Sure, they would have had plenty of time to come to terms with it.

      Church is one of those third-spaces that the unemployed and retired flock to when they’ve got too much time and not a ton of money. A great deal of the appeal of these places, especially back in my parents’ day, was as a social center with a feel-good energy. As a born-and-raised Houstonian I’ve seen it work on enormous numbers of otherwise-religiously-apathetic people. The whole Joel Osteen model is Good Vibes as a religious experience. One big Jesus Themed Pep Rally.

      I think you can probably logic your way to a “God’s Not Real” conclusion with a generic religiously-ambivalent lay person. But I don’t think a simple logic chain is enough to convince folks who consider religion a form of community recreation to stop showing up. No more than you could talk someone out of blaring their favorite brand of Country Music or driving an oversized pickup truck or playing with their toy guns down at the gun range.

      These just aren’t logical decisions. They are social decisions.

      • HelixDab2@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 month ago

        I don’t know that my parents were ever the kind of person that bitched about paying taxes. They might have privately, but i don’t remember it ever being a big deal. Me, I understand that my taxes are too low for what I expect the gov’t to be doing.

        And you’re exactly right about the social experience. One of the enormous struggles for atheists has been building a community. Churches fill that need, even though they cause real harms in other ways. If you go to a church, it’s easy to meet people and make friends when you move to a new community. If you don’t, well, good luck because you’re going to need it.

      • ZombiFrancis@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 month ago

        I got a Father in Law that tithes his retirement income from the military to his church and votes hard republican. But he abstained from Trump voting so he considers himself enlightened.

        They are social decisions.

        Exactly.

  • Uriel238 [all pronouns]@lemmy.blahaj.zone
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    1 month ago

    Yeah, I warn those who are challenging their own faith that naturalism isn’t for everyone. For me it was a stark process to come to terms that I’m thinking meat, and my species is looking at some imminent great filters even before we are able to create a dependent colony on our own moon, so mostly harmless is going to be more of a footnote than our society deserves.

    As someone who had an early aspiration to add something significant to the collective community that it could take with it into the future, this proved to be a bit of a let-down.

    • rezifon@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      What aspects of naturalism do you feel negate the reality of our collective community? I really don’t see how the one led you to the other.

    • theotherbelow@lemmynsfw.com
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      Don’t get two hung up on great filters. We could’ve easy passed a few of them in the last hundred million years. You’re much more than thinking meat, you have feelings and a perspective over time. its amazing not a liability.

      Even if boom over, it was loads of fun.

  • bennypr0fane@discuss.tchncs.de
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    1 month ago

    So weird to see more than one-third downvotes, when all the comments are atheist-supporting. Maybe many read this comic as anti-atheistic (“what a jerk he is for making his poor mom unhappy!”)?

    • Gsus4@mander.xyz
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      edit-2
      1 month ago

      At some point you need to ask yourself what you’re releasing people from when there is no (low-effort, low-pain) failsafe individual thought structure to give their life meaning… :'/ so I get both sides…

    • Zagorath@aussie.zone
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      I think it’s hard to read the comic itself as anything but anti-atheistic. Or at the very least, anti-vocal-atheist.

  • whaleross@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    edit-2
    1 month ago

    Soo what is the message here? Atheists are incel neckbeard basement dwellers and god is as real as one of their mother?

    Edit: Oh wait I misread the comic in the most funny way! I read it as “my mum god” as if he stopped believing in his mum as a deity. Tired brain plays weird tricks.

    • Flax@feddit.uk
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      It’s about atheists who make atheism their whole personality.

      • Pennomi@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 month ago

        In other words, “anti-theists” instead of just atheists.

        Most people whose personalities revolves around being anti-something are insufferable. It’s far better to be for something than against something.

        Like, I grew up Mormon, and left when I grew old enough to think for myself. Among my friends who also left the church, there are two major categories: the “post-mormons” and the “anti-mormons”. The anti-mormons are miserable to be around while the rest of us decided we’d rather build our lives around what we love, not what we hate.

        • Flax@feddit.uk
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          edit-2
          1 month ago

          Probably a better description/label tbh

          If anything then, the post is depicting antitheists, not just atheists

        • Geobloke@lemm.ee
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          1 month ago

          This 100%, craft beer drinkers can be just as insufferable when they get someone to “enjoy” a sour for the first time

    • Scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      That no matter how righteous you believe you are, there are ramifications to your actions with religion. It’s very easy to understand and be comfortable with those beliefs, but with others you are quite literally messing with their identities who they are.

      My family is deeply religious. I personally don’t care if they believe in God or not. I focus on individual teachings, that gay people aren’t evil, that they can be religious and believe contradictory things to what others believe, that it’s all deeply personal

      • Hyphlosion@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 month ago

        There’s also ramifications to ruining one’s religious beliefs, as this comic shows.

        If you’re going to completely and utterly destroy someone’s entire outlook on life (and afterlife or whatever), I’d argue that you have a moral responsibility to help them transition and be there for them. Not be a total asshole like the dude in the comic.

        • Scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          1 month ago

          A good addition, I agree. I know my mother draws her strength from the church. Without it I’m sure she would be depressed at home. It would require someone showing her how to be self reliant and grabbing satisfaction from that to get her going again

    • DaGeek247@fedia.io
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      Soo what is the message here?

      That proselytizing about atheism without considering the needs and character of your audience can be just as bad as religion doing the same.

      Love is more important than being right, and the son in the comic very clearly didn’t show any. As soon as he proved his point, he left to go celebrate with his friends rather than spend time with his mother. He failed to show her that just because there is no big sky god doesn’t mean that is no love.

      • greenskye@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 month ago

        Not shown is the mother hatefully oppressing others due to her religion.

        Religion can be both helpful to those that follow it while also causing those same people to do or support horrific things in its name.

        • DaGeek247@fedia.io
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          1 month ago

          Not shown is the mother hatefully oppressing others due to her religion.

          Yes. Exactly. “Not shown”. That’s not part of this comic. You’ve brought it in all on your own. You’ve missed the point of the comic if that’s what you’re focused on. Everybody here knows that religion can harm people. That’s not the point of this comic. The point is that the way the son character went about his goals was exactly as destructive as the way that religion does. It was a warning to ensure that your discussion include love for the people behind the discussion, and not just hate for them for being wrong.

          • Christian@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            1 month ago

            It was a warning to ensure that your discussion include love for the people behind the discussion, and not just hate for them for being wrong.

            I think I’ve gone over twenty years with this being the exact thing that bothers me and have never been able to articulate it as well as you just did in one sentence.

    • Warehouse@lemmy.ca
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      edit-2
      1 month ago

      Faces of Atheism was considered pretty cringe, and for the most part it was (as would have any “faces of x” group been on Reddit), but the idea behind it wasn’t made in isolation.

  • mojofrododojo@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    1 month ago

    delivering someone from a lifetime of sexual and gender oppression, and eliminating their need to tithe a portion of their income to an organization that hides and protects pedophiles and rapists?

    Mom’s on the floor weeping with joy.

        • Victor@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          1 month ago

          Not every church sends their tithe to the Vatican. Not all christians are Catholic. And not every church has paedophiles.

          But I condemn all that do. It’s horrible. Disgusting and despicable. I have two kids, and it drives me insane to think someone would consider doing that to them. 😡

  • Rooty@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    1 month ago

    Oh boy, I sure love the ol’ “atheists are filthy neckbeards” canard. Haven’t heard that one before.

    • Blubber28@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      Don’t forget the “not believing in god = sadness” one. Realizing it is fake actually brought relief for the ex-religious people that I know (anecdotal, I know. I don’t have the actual numbers).

      • milk@discuss.tchncs.de
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 month ago

        Thats a little unfair. Most religous people have been religious for most of their lives and it makes up a large part of it. Being convinced their whole philosophy is wrong would crush some people

      • thermal_shock@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 month ago

        Exactly. Use your own brain, not rely on a sky daddy who literally gave you instructions on how to own slaves.

  • Krafty Kactus@sopuli.xyz
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    1 month ago

    To be honest, I don’t think a lot of people are ready. It’s a hard thing to deconstruct your faith and if you’re not careful it can take you to some really dark places. For a lot of people it’s the way they find meaning and solace in a world of pain. Ultimately if you can find that comfort without tying it to religion that’s better but not everyone can. That’s my take on it post-deconversion

    • Natanox@discuss.tchncs.de
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      It’s more of a generational issue, really. Convincing someone who was already indoctrinated as a baby and began to “pray” as early as their arm coordination allowed it is almost cruel, really. At that point it’s reality-shattering. Let alone if your religion included any kind of body-modification, especially without anesthesia (that shit burns itself into the very fabric of your brain as a baby). In that case it’s even worse, as it’d entail the realisation that your body has been violated (some may use stronger wording).

      At the end of the day what counts is that you’re a decent person, no matter your stance on religion or spirituality.

      • HubertManne@piefed.social
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 month ago

        I mean the boomers were the hippie generation so really its only the silent generation that really as a matter of course had that indoctrination and the youngest of them is in their eighties. For those below eighty its about being raised in a culture that can keep you insulated enough to not watch media or meet many people not like yourself.

    • Dr. Moose@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      Not to offend you but tbh I hate this thought process and imo this smells of superiority complex “peasants are just not ready for reality yet”. The peasants are actually really smart and humans are very good at adapting and changing their world model given appropriate motivation.

      The world is absolutely ready to rid itself of religion.

    • Furbag@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      I try not to be too judgemental of people who are religious. We are not evolved enough as a species to be able to comprehend the unknown or unknowable, and everyone to some degree has to cope with this somehow, even if we aren’t consciously aware of it. Faith is an easy, convenient and catch-all solution to all of life’s unexplained phenomena, so it makes sense that people tend to gravitate towards it naturally, all it takes is a little push during childhood.

      I take issue with it when religious folk try to force their views onto other people. Proselytizing is one thing, but converting people by duress or force, or by weaponizing the government apparatus to conform to their views and their views only, is where I stop caring about the feelings of those religious cults and do everything in my power to stop them or undermine their efforts.

    • TheFriar@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      Also, it really just depends on your age. Have you believed for decades? Not believing at some point in your life will be some kind of earth shaking change.

    • samus12345@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      Yeah, going from finding fulfillment through religion to finding it through other means isn’t something you can do instantly.

  • Godric@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    1 month ago

    Me at 13 discovering I wont see my loved ones ever again and there’s nobody’s hand on my shoulder holding me up:

  • smol_beans@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    1 month ago

    I’m an atheist but I understand that religion and/or faith makes a lot of people happy and I don’t want to take that happiness away from them.

    • BoxOfFeet@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      I do. It’s such a waste of time. I’m not going to start anything with people, I don’t have the patience or energy for that. And honestly, i don’t have any debate skills. But I really wish I could just take it all away. Isn’t it better to be right than to be happy?

    • Adalast@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 month ago

      Agnostic here and yeah, most atheists and agnostics I have ever met are about the same. We don’t care if YOU believe. We care that you care we don’t. Most of us will never utter a word against your religion and beliefs as long as you “do unto others” and all that jazz. This comic reaks of being drawn by a Christian about how they think Athiests behave and feel. This video is ancient now, but I get the same vibes off this comic.

      • JayDee@lemmy.sdf.org
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 month ago

        I take this comic to be more poking fun at the portion of atheists who make their entire personality around disproving God’s existence - people who try to spread atheism the same way christians spread their own gospel. It’s largely not applicable to other atheists.

        • Adalast@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          1 month ago

          Yeah, those aren’t athiests, they are assholes. Anyone who prosthelytizes is an asshole. Period.