It’s a pretty widely accepted fact that no matter your citizenship, the party will always consider you Chinese ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Out of curiosity, do you know where the phenomenon of Chinese people, outside china, referring to locals as ”外国人“ stems from？I’ve found this fascinating as in english you refer to yourself as a foreigner when you are in another country, not the locals.
Is this just a language thing, or is this also influenced by the mindset brought on by heavier nationalism (than I’m used to, anyway, in Australia), in your opinion?
Out of curiosity, do you know where the phenomenon of Chinese people, outside china, referring to locals as ”外国人“ stems from？I’ve found this fascinating as in english you refer to yourself as a foreigner when you are in another country, not the locals.
Idk what people using Mandarin say, I don’t talk to Mandarin speakers a lot. In Cantonese, its “鬼佬” which is probably most accurately translated as “outsider”, rather than “foreigner” (as in terms of nationality/citizenship). As for “外国人”, I think people just conflate country with ethnicity, and also because the “国” (country) would be referring to the ancestral country, not the country they’re currently at, so I assume it also is supposed to mean “outsider”.
These are bascially just a all encompassing terms to use to describe people who are not ethnically Chinese. And to clarify, I don’t think these terms are inherently hostile, I think its more like not feeling welcomed/accepted by the local community. It can be used both positively or negatively depending on context. Its tribalism basically, because you’re in an unfamiliar place and you feel like you want to stick together to survive.
Because… think about it this way, Wong Kim Ark, was by default, denied of his birthright US Citizenship because he was non-white, and he had to fight a court case over it (he won, this happened all the way back in 1898). So imagine being in that time period, imagine all the discrimination and xenophobia, you can see why the “outsider” term would be used, right? I think this sentinment just continued down to present day.
Really appreciate your insights on this, and can understand tribalism in the context of being treated as an outsider. Also, even in countries where foreigners’ work rights are relatively not that much worse than the locals (Australia), there is still plenty of people being taken advantage of because they’re afraid of losing their visa (people not on permanent visas).
I think your analysis makes sense, because the Mandarin speakers I’ve heard also don’t refer to Australian born Chinese as 外国人 (foreigners), but rather as 华人 (something like ethnically Chinese). So I do suspect they’re using 外国人 as an ethnic catch all for any races not historically from China.
Perhaps I’m missing something, but I still find this use interesting, because 国 (country) doesn’t just refer to China, but any country in general（法国，德国，美国）this makes my understanding that speakers are always speaking from the perspective of their country of origin, rather than where they physically actually are.
It’s a pretty widely accepted fact that no matter your citizenship, the party will always consider you Chinese ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Out of curiosity, do you know where the phenomenon of Chinese people, outside china, referring to locals as ”外国人“ stems from？I’ve found this fascinating as in english you refer to yourself as a foreigner when you are in another country, not the locals.
Is this just a language thing, or is this also influenced by the mindset brought on by heavier nationalism (than I’m used to, anyway, in Australia), in your opinion?
Idk what people using Mandarin say, I don’t talk to Mandarin speakers a lot. In Cantonese, its “鬼佬” which is probably most accurately translated as “outsider”, rather than “foreigner” (as in terms of nationality/citizenship). As for “外国人”, I think people just conflate country with ethnicity, and also because the “国” (country) would be referring to the ancestral country, not the country they’re currently at, so I assume it also is supposed to mean “outsider”.
These are bascially just a all encompassing terms to use to describe people who are not ethnically Chinese. And to clarify, I don’t think these terms are inherently hostile, I think its more like not feeling welcomed/accepted by the local community. It can be used both positively or negatively depending on context. Its tribalism basically, because you’re in an unfamiliar place and you feel like you want to stick together to survive.
Because… think about it this way, Wong Kim Ark, was by default, denied of his birthright US Citizenship because he was non-white, and he had to fight a court case over it (he won, this happened all the way back in 1898). So imagine being in that time period, imagine all the discrimination and xenophobia, you can see why the “outsider” term would be used, right? I think this sentinment just continued down to present day.
Really appreciate your insights on this, and can understand tribalism in the context of being treated as an outsider. Also, even in countries where foreigners’ work rights are relatively not that much worse than the locals (Australia), there is still plenty of people being taken advantage of because they’re afraid of losing their visa (people not on permanent visas).
I think your analysis makes sense, because the Mandarin speakers I’ve heard also don’t refer to Australian born Chinese as 外国人 (foreigners), but rather as 华人 (something like ethnically Chinese). So I do suspect they’re using 外国人 as an ethnic catch all for any races not historically from China.
Perhaps I’m missing something, but I still find this use interesting, because 国 (country) doesn’t just refer to China, but any country in general（法国，德国，美国）this makes my understanding that speakers are always speaking from the perspective of their country of origin, rather than where they physically actually are.
Language is interesting!